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philosophy

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philosophy

Postby Milo » Mon Mar 07, 2016 5:25 pm

PZ Myers has a post http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2016/03/07/emotionally-invested-in-despising-philosophy/ about people who dismiss philosophy. I'll admit right up front I have no education in philosophy and no aptitude for it, but I have never heard a philosophic argument that convinced me of anything. Especially when it comes from William Lane Craig trying to prove God exists. I'm sure philosophy is highly edifying, but if a scientist tried to prove a theory using word games I wouldn't be convinced either. What's the opinion here? Looks like I agree Bill Nye, Neil DeGrasse Tyson, and Stephen Hawking. PZ thinks there’s a bit of ego-boosting behind the dismissal of philosophy. It may be a case of dismissing what you don't understand but philosophy does not appear to be as relevant as it once was.
Stop doubting and beleive Milo. Then everything will make sense.
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Re: philosophy

Postby zilch » Mon Mar 07, 2016 6:07 pm

In my humble opinion, a lot of philosophy is bunk, because it is not informed by the real world. But some philosophers have something worthwhile to say.
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Re: philosophy

Postby E-lad » Mon Mar 07, 2016 7:45 pm

Philosophy runs along side the railroad tracks yelling out (sometimes useful) ideas to science, which is at the controls of the train.
Life is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.- Horace Walpole
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Re: philosophy

Postby Milo » Mon Mar 07, 2016 11:25 pm

Good opinions from both of you.
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Re: philosophy

Postby BeamStalk » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:40 pm

I am trying to understand it more and I am always willing to learn, but for the most part it does just seem like word games and silly thought problems.
The truth may be out there, but the lies are inside your head.
-Terry Pratchett, "Hogfather"
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Re: philosophy

Postby Weemaryanne » Wed Mar 09, 2016 12:13 am

If philosophy is really about how to think and how we know what we know, then IMHO it's too important to be left to philosophers. High schools should at least offer it as an elective, and college kids should be required to get at least a taste of it.

I say "if" because I haven't been impressed by such philosophers as I've heard to date. Years ago I heard an elderly prof on some public television program insisting that after many years in the field, he had finally begun grappling with the most compelling problem of his career. "And that is. . .?" the interviewer inquired.

"The concept of Nothing!" was the triumphant reply.

I switched to something else.
Of course truth is stranger than fiction. Fiction has to make sense. (Mark Twain)
I try to be cynical, but I just can't keep up. (Lily Tomlin)
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Re: philosophy

Postby rufustfirefly » Wed Mar 09, 2016 6:04 am

Personally, I think Meyers is simply jealous of the people he criticizes. Now it's Nye, he'll be digging up and pissing on Sagan and Gould before too long.
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Re: philosophy

Postby zilch » Wed Mar 09, 2016 8:21 am

I just read PZ's post, and I pretty much agree with him, as far as it goes. Philosophers are (or should be) good at formal logic. It's when they allow formal logic to run around its hamster wheel disconnected from the real world of brute facts, that they tend to spout garbage. Daniel Dennett is a good example of a philosopher who doesn't do this: he looks at the facts first, then philosophizes. His input has helped shape science, at least in the case of Richard Dawkins. So philosophers are not necessarily useless.
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Re: philosophy

Postby Chris » Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:26 am

What many seem to miss is that all science is is philosophy + knowledge.

Would anyone be interested in a sort of informal lesson in philosophy? More than happy to oblige if there are any takers.
If perchance I have offended, think but this, and all is mended, that you have but slumbered here, while a vision did appear. A Midsummer Night's Dream
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Re: philosophy

Postby E-lad » Thu Mar 10, 2016 11:36 am

Chris wrote:What many seem to miss is that all science is is philosophy + knowledge.

Would anyone be interested in a sort of informal lesson in philosophy? More than happy to oblige if there are any takers.


Yes, and I do stand corrected, although I do think that scientists are probably more dependent on critical thinking and proper reasoning rather than raw philosophy but at the same time it is important to remember that most 'scientists' degrees awarded are PhD, which is Doctor of Philosophy.
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