Nothing new here...repackaged and recycled...

[BathTub]

Yeah, fair enough.

[Happy Humanist]

Matt,

I don't know how long this series will go, but I want to consider the age of the earth first. Then I'll move into the molecular arguments in favor of creation. I'll specifically cover the discipline of genetics and at that point I can discuss ERVs. I always welcome questions. I guess I miss teaching more than I thought. I hope you check back. I don't want you to miss the posts on genetics!

Celee

Looks like she's going to tackle ERVs at some point in the future - watch this space!

So instead of handling something in her field, she is going to jump out of it and talk about geology.

You think SHE is out in left field ---you ought to read about this guy who she mentions in her blog:

At our current church I have been blessed to sit under the tutelage of a retired chemistry professor. During his last years at the university he made creation vs. evolution a particular focus of his study, with an emphasis on radiometric dating. He has led many interesting talks at our church and recently wrote a book. While he was writing the book, I was able to read the first drafts. When I first realized the claims he was making I was a little shocked, but he sure does make a strong argument. I have loved it! His name is Russell Arndts and his book is "Geocentricity, Relativity, and the Big Bang."

So I looked up the book he wrote.

This is from the back cover of his book:

Geocentrism--could it be true after all?

The notion that the earth is motionless and is at the very center of the universe was proven to be false centuries ago. Or was it? According to scientist Russell Arndts, the idea of a geocentric universe should never have been abandoned. The Michelson-Morley experiment of 1887--one of the most famous and important experiments in the history of physics--proved beyond question that the earth is stationary. The author contends that big bang cosmology and Einstein's theories of relativity were invented to cover up the results of that experiment. And they have led science in the wrong direction--a belief that the universe is bigger and older than it really is.

This book will make you reexamine everything you thought you knew about the universe. I will help you answer the "light from distant stars in a young universe" problem. As this book makes clear, the earth is not just a speck of dust orbiting an inconsequential star. It is the very centerpiece of God's creation.

About the author

Russell Arndts has a BS in chemistry, an MS in organic chemistry and a PhD in inorganic chemistry from Louisiana State University. His study of origins began in 1968, a path that led him to becoming president of the Bible-Science Association (now Creation Moments). For 35 years he was a professor of chemistry at St. Cloud State University.

What are these people smoking???

[BathTub]

Wow and I was only jokingly ask if she believed in Heliocentric Theory.

[shadowmouse]

Oh, man...away we go...

What is Truth? said...
captain howdy said...

"If you're a trained biologist, you should know what endogenous retroviruses are and how they contribute to the evidence for common ancestry."



Universal common ancestry

Evolutionists gloss over two important facts when making this argument: First, many retroviruses can infect both humans and apes. The most notable of these is HIV, which is widely believed to have originated as SIV in chimpanzees, but can also infect humans, apes, and monkeys. It is entirely possible, therefore, that humans and apes were independently infected with the same virus. Second, some retroviruses have been shown to have highly targeted insertion points, meaning that the virus selects very specific segments of the genome for insertion. Consequently, it is entirely possible that the same virus infected both humans and apes, and targeted the same location. This seems especially plausible in light of the fact that humans and apes have tens of thousands of endogenous retroviruses in their respective genomes -- at least a few of the retroviruses are likely to infect both humans and apes at the same location.
Additionally, scientists have determined that some endogenous retroviruses are indispensable to a species' life or reproduction If the retrovirus is advantageous in some way, that would explain how the retrovirus spread to the entire species. It also presents the possibility that retroviruses were used as part of the creative process, as retroviruses are often used in genetic engineering today, to introduce new genetic material to cells.

Conservapedia.

February 8, 2010 5:09 PM

[BathTub]

Yeah I replied that his cut and paste simply shows he doesn't understand the issue. He's also using accuracy in a misleading way. If research had shown that insertion points were as accurate as Creationists need them to be then they would be able to say Research shows "Virus X inserts itself at point Y" as the analogy goes "Dropping 2 needles from space and they both land in the same molecule of dirt", repeatedly. When in reality when they do have a preference it's like saying "Dropping the needles from space, they more often hit the US rather than Canada".

And of course this is for all the insertion points in our DNA.

Our Genome is something in the order or 8% viral, last I saw.

[Quasar]

It is entirely possible, therefore, that humans and apes were independently infected with the same virus.

Yes. It is. But not in the same location.

Probability statistics, people: you multiply the probability of virus X seperately infecting humans and chimps (and gorilla's. And orangutans. And gibbons. And old world monkeys. And new world monkeys) by the probability of it infecting going to the exact same place.

Consequently, it is entirely possible that the same virus infected both humans and apes, and targeted the same location.

What Bathtub said about the needles from space.

This seems especially plausible in light of the fact that humans and apes have tens of thousands of endogenous retroviruses in their respective genomes -- at least a few of the retroviruses are likely to infect both humans and apes at the same location.

Interesting, then, that all the retrovirus's that infect both apes and humans are members of the HERV-K family, which makes up less than 1% of HERV elements.

I am impressed however. I have never seen a creationist try to answer this question.

[BathTub]

Jeff piles on the stupid.

Jeff said...

Dear Mr. Comfort,

I just wanted to share a non-copy written quote with you--it's quite remarkable really.

We found today amongst our homeschool information, a flyer from a museum and fish hatchery we had visited at the Bonneville Dam, in Oregon, where we previously lived.

It was produced by the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife, written in 1993. Again there is NO copyright on the information. The heading on the flyer reads:

Herptiles
[Reptiles and Amphibians]
"Millions of years ago a creature none of us would recognize, taking a risk we still do not understand, kicked, scratched, and pulled itself from the warmth and safety of its watery home to lie gasping for a few seconds on the shore. The creature's visit was short, frightening and certainly unsuccessful, since it must have failed in it attempt to breathe on land. Nonetheless, the terrestrial visit by an aquatic animal signaled the beginning of the age of amphibians and set into motion a land-based evolutionary process that continues to this day."

After much laughter, I realized that 20 years ago I too would have "bought" this reasoning, hook, line, and sinker because I was absolutely ignorant, yet thought pridefully that I "knew" everything---thank you, thank you, thank you for educating us!!

We are supporters of the Living Waters Ministries and The Way of the Master. My husband was soundly saved through your messages in 2007--Glory to God! We are so grateful to the Lord for your ministries more than words could ever express..all we can say is thank you Brother Ray with tears in our eyes, smiles on our faces, and joy in our hearts.

In Him, Becky Graham

Fish breathing air? Impossible!



Fish walking on land? Impossible!



Evolutionauts so crazy!

Now tell me the story about the talking Donky again Unca Ray!

[BathTub]

Damn, kudos to What is Truth...

Steven,
Thank you for the swift response to my post, I googled “endogenous retroviruses” and Conservapedia came up with what you read in my post. Obviously Conservapedia seems to have left out a significant amount of relevant info here. It was not my intent for the post to Captain Howdy to be an “I’ve got you now” kind of thing, maybe just an alternative theory. I guess I fall on the sword here. I know almost nothing about any of this stuff so thanks for the explanations

He wasn't a total ass about it.

[rufustfirefly]

What is Truth must be a false convert. He/she will get hit like Annette Acker.

[ExPatMatt]

What is Truth must be a false convert. He/she will get hit like Annette Acker.

Good call.