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Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Questions

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Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Questions

Postby ThorGoLucky » Mon Jun 01, 2015 10:31 pm

Today's white folks aren't necessarily to blame for injustices of yesteryear and now, but we all have a responsibility for improvement. "You didn't ask to be born half-way up a mountain, but you were, and I need you to look down and realize that mountain is really a pile of bones."

http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-helpful-a ... questions/
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby BaldySlaphead » Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:11 am

Excellent article - very nicely articulated!
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby zilch » Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:52 am

Cracked nowadays is savvy social commentary disguised as hip teen comedy. I'm continually impressed by them.
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby Ryk » Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:03 am

...
Last edited by Ryk on Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby Ryk » Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:26 am

Really I don't agree and I don't care. I was born, I live, I respect everyone based on their accomplishments, effort, character, and demeanor. Not race, gender, orientation, wealth, circumstances...whatever. I acknowledge that my race, gender etc give me both advantages and disadvantages but I don't care that is beyond my control, I didn't ask for it, I didn't expect it and any benefit is just a happy but unplanned circumstance, just as the rather significant drawbacks stemming from my genetics are unplanned and unasked for. All I can do is my best. The fact that despite being mixed race I appear white may be an advantage but..so what? As Popeye said "I yamsk whatsk I yamsk". I have had no shortage of struggles and I have overcome, if someone hasn't overcome he should blame himself and work harder because in the end crying " privilege" and "poor me" may make one feel better (if feeling like a victim is something you like) it doesn't make anything better. Life isn't fair, it isn't a level playing field and never will be. Even if we eliminated race and gender as factors there will always be people smarter, stronger, better looking, wealthier or more charismatic. At that point some people will work harder and do better, others will just cry "You are just benefiting from your smart privilege or your strong privilege, you need to be less strong or less smart so I can be equal." I can't play basketball like Michael Jordan or do math like Stephen Hawkings, I'll never have the advanrages of birth that Malia Obama or Jaden Smith have but I can work hard, study hard, have integrity and make my life full and happy without saying "If only my Dad had been the President or a famous actor."
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby E-lad » Wed Jun 03, 2015 1:06 pm

Well said, but it can be complicated on an individual level.
Once again from my daughter, back in the 60's and 70's when the mental health community was first tackling the problems of treating child abuse, they treated the victims, as victims and groomed them to believe that life can never be the same.
- this is highly simplified, but now days they teach these victims of abuse to be 'survivors' and the outcomes for these individuals has become much better as long as they get proper treatment.
Along with that, there are just individuals who let abuse shed off of them like water off a ducks back while others seem more traumatized.

I've worked with people of different races that don't even seem to notice that they are a different race- it doesn't seem to matter to them, as Ryk describes. There have been a few- actually very few, that hold onto that victim status.

In the case of Mrs Froggie, who is an electrician and carpenter, she never seemed to notice that girls can't do that! :lol:

In my own case, If only my father had been a millionaire and left me lots of money everything would have been better. Poor me!!!
Life is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.- Horace Walpole
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby ThorGoLucky » Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:30 pm

> "You are just benefiting from your smart privilege or your strong privilege, you need to be less strong or less smart so I can be equal."

A straw man argument. And as the article says, it's not about blame; it's about responsibility.
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby BeamStalk » Wed Jun 03, 2015 7:03 pm

ThorGoLucky wrote:> "You are just benefiting from your smart privilege or your strong privilege, you need to be less strong or less smart so I can be equal."

A straw man argument. And as the article says, it's not about blame; it's about responsibility.



You say that and sounds all well and good, then there is reality, where what Ryk said is not a straw man.

https://archive.is/xqqqs

I don’t think parents reading their children bedtime stories should constantly have in their minds the way that they are unfairly disadvantaging other people’s children, but I think they should have that thought occasionally.
...
‘The evidence shows that the difference between those who get bedtime stories and those who don’t—the difference in their life chances—is bigger than the difference between those who get elite private schooling and those that don’t,’ he says.
...
‘We could prevent elite private schooling without any real hit to healthy family relationships, whereas if we say that you can’t read bedtime stories to your kids because it’s not fair that some kids get them and others don’t, then that would be too big a hit at the core of family life.’


So yeah...
The truth may be out there, but the lies are inside your head.
-Terry Pratchett, "Hogfather"
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby ThorGoLucky » Wed Jun 03, 2015 8:33 pm

Yes, BeanStalk, there are indeed some irrational extremists out there. The article did not say or imply such a thing. Straw man argument indeed.
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Re: Helpful Answers To Society's Most Uncomfortable Question

Postby Ryk » Wed Jun 03, 2015 11:50 pm

Thorgotlucky. I don't see it as a straw man, there are people who really do see equality as being equality of outcome rather than equality of opportunity and that was what I was trying to illustrate. Equality of outcome can not be achieved, attempting to do so will cause any advantage a person has to be perceived as "privilege". I do not deny that privilege does exist and when it is institutionalized and systematic it should be opposed if it denies equality of opportunity, however it is not unusual at all for privileged classes such as white, male, heterosexual, cis, able bodied people to have no greater opportunity than anyone else. The supposed privilege they have may grant a small measure of comfortability but no actual increased opportunity.
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